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Talk:Potter family
The Blacks and the Potters are related! Me and another user had a whole ginourmus disscussion over her blog and we think that we figured this out! The blacks and the Potters are relater and teh Lupins are also related to the blacks and the potters and this is why! Sirius said int he fifth book quote "all pureblood families are realted!" meaning that Sirius and Merope Riddle nee Guant are related meaning that Regulus and Sirius are realted to Voldemort. Also Voldemort is decended from the second brother (otherwise how would have Marvolo gotten the ring) and harry and the potters are decended from the third brother (thats how they got the cloak). Also, Nymphadora's mother who is Bellatrix's sister who is Sirius's cousin married Lupin married that all of those families are related! alicenadjasperforever peoples (send me an owl, no howlers or ill bite) 00:03, March 29, 2010 (UTC) :Yes, and the Blacks and Potters are related anyway because Harry married Ginny, who's family is related to the Blacks.--[[User:Lord Voldemort killed the vampire James|''L.V.K.T.V.J.]] ([[User talk:Lord Voldemort killed the vampire James|Send an owl!]]) 23:06, March 29, 2010 (UTC) It said possibly so I thought that it ment before they were married... Well, it sadi possibly next to black family so I thought that that would meant that they could have been married before Harry and Ginny were married. Because before James and Siruis even met they were first cousins once rmoved or something like that! alicenadjasperforever peoples (send me an owl, no howlers or ill bite) 23:29, March 29, 2010 (UTC) Family (I) We all know that... *...Albus Severus Potter is born to Harry and Ginny Potter. *...James Sirius Potter is born to Harry and Ginny Potter. *...Lily Luna Potter is born to Harry and Ginny Potter. *...Harry Potter and Ginny Weasley are married. *...Harry Potter is born to James and Lily Potter. *...James Potter and Lily Evans are married. *...James Potter is born to Mr. Potter and Mrs. Potter. *...Charlus Potter and Dorea Black are married. *...A Child is born to Charlus and Dorea Potter. *...A Child is born to Ignotus Peverell and his wife. But we are not sure on that... *...If Charlus and Dorea Potter is the parents of James Potter. *...Who Charlus and Dorea Potter's Son is. *...Who Ignotus and His Wife Peverell's Son is. Here's what I think, I think that... *...James Potter's parents' names is Mr. Potter and Mrs. Potter. *...Mr. Potter's parents is Charlus and Dorea Potter/Charlus and Dorea Potter's Son is Mr. Potter. *...Charlus Potter is born to Ignotus Peverell and his wife/Ignotus and His Wife Peverell's Son is Charlus Potter. --Danniesen 28 July 2010 18:02 :Charlus Potter can't be Ignotus's son, if he were then he would have been Charlus Peverell. Ignotus must have had at least one female descendant who received the cloak and married a Potter. --BachLynn23 16:20, July 29, 2010 (UTC) It is possible that he was named Charlus Peverell but changed his surname to Potter. --Danniesen 30 July 2010 13:08 I have been thinking about it. The Mirror of Erised mentioned 10 people when Harry saw it. Some had green eyes, one had the same knees. I think the 10 people are: *Lily Potter née Evans *Mr. Evans *Mrs. Evans *James Potter *Mr. Potter *Mrs. Potter *Charlus Potter *Dorea Potter née Black *Ignotus Peverell *Mrs. Peverell --Danniesen 31 July 2010 10:34 Haven't been able to find Charlus in a name meaning search but did find Carlus as a Latin form of Charles - so likely that is who Charlie Weasley was named after. We don't know how many sons Linfred (the Potterer) of Stinchcombe had or whether they all took the surname Potter - it is possible that Harry and Charlus descended from different sons of Linfred. Not sure how far back the blood protection that Lily bestowed on Harry goes in the generations. (Vaudree (talk) 22:58, December 13, 2015 (UTC)) Who the Potters are close to I'm just curious, but being that this article refers to the entire Potter family, and not individuals, is it really wholly accurate to say that "the Potters" are/were "very" close to the weasley family, sirius black and Albus Dumbledore? Some of the Potters were close to the weasley family, from Harry on, there's no record anywhere that the Weasley's were close to the potters before harry and ron went to school together. Sirius Black was close to at least 3 generations of potters (James, probably James's parents, and definitely harry). It just seems like there are too many generations of Potters to be so specific about who the Potters were "very" close to. --BachLynn23 01:51, July 31, 2010 (UTC) Family (II) :'If''' that assumption was correct, the Peverells would have lived in around the 1860s or 1870s. This is incorrect, as we know the Peverells lived well before Beedle the Bard (15th century) and have also predated Emeric the Evil (early Middle Ages) and Barnabas Deverill (18th century). We also know the Peverell name was among the first pure-blood names to become extinct in the male line, so it is very unlikely this happened at that point in history. Thus, your theory is very lacking. -- [[User:Seth Cooper| Seth Cooper ]][[User talk:Seth Cooper| owl post!]] 16:23, September 20, 2010 (UTC) Potter family *Mr Peverell m. ? **Ignotus Peverell m. ? ***Daughter (somewhow descedndant of Ignotus married ? Potter ****Generations of Potters *****Charlus Potter m. Dorea Black ******Son (could be James Potter I) m. ? *******James Potter I (probably fits in here) m. Lily Evans ********Harry Potter **Cadmus Peverell m. ? ***Generations of Peverells/Gaunts ****Marvolo Gaunt *****Merope Gaunt m. Tom Riddle Sr. ******Voldemort *****Morfin Gaunt **Antioch Peverell *Eduardus Limette Black *Alexia Walkin Back *Phoebe Black *Mr Black m. Ms Tripe **Arcturus Black I **Misapinoa Black m. Jimbo Blishwick **Cygnus Black I m. Ella Max ***Elladora Black ***Isla Black m. Bob Hitchens ***Sirius Black I ***Phineas Nigellus Black m. Ursula Flint ****Sirius Black II m. Hesper Gamp *****Regulus Black I *****Lycoris Black *****Arcturus Black III m. Melania Macmillan ******Lucretia Black m. Ignatius Prewett ******Orion Black m. Walburga Black *******Sirius Black III *******Regulus Black II ****Belvina Black m. Herbert Burke *****Caractacus Burke ****Arcturus Black II m. Lysandra Yaxley *****Callidora Black m. Harfang Longbottom ******Algernon Longbottom m. Enid ? ******Longbottom m. ? *******Frank Longbottom m. Alice ? ********Neville Longbottom *****Charis Black m. Caspar Crouch ******Barty Crouch Sr. m. ? *******Barty Crouch Jr. *****Cedrella Black m. Septimus Weasley ******Arthur Weasley m. Molly Prewett *******Weasley Family ****Phineas Black ****Cygnus Black II m. Violetta Bulstrode *****Cassiopeia Black *****Marius Black *****Dorea Black m. Charlus Potter ******Son (could be James Potter I) m. ? *******James Potter I (probably fits in here) m. Lily Evans ********Harry Potter ******Pollux Black m. Irma Crabbe *******Alphard Black *******Walburga Black m. Orion Black ********Sirius Black III ********Regulus Black II *******Cygnus Black III m. Druella Rosier ********Bellatrix Black m. Rodolphus Lestrange ********Narcissa Black m. Lucius Malfoy *********Draco Malfoy ********Andromeda Black m. Ted Tonks *********Nymphadora Tonks m. Remus Lupin **********Teddy Lupin Thanks, Happychickenvermin 00:47, December 12, 2010 (UTC) Charlus Potter's name Are we absolutely 150% sure that this is not meant to be Charles Potter and the handwriting was not written poorly/difficult to read? S*a*p*h*n*a 18:16, December 13, 2015 (UTC) :Definitely "Charlus". See here. -- [[User:Seth Cooper| Seth Cooper ]][[User talk:Seth Cooper| owl post!]] 20:00, December 13, 2015 (UTC) Potion Skills and Flowery Names I find it interesting that Harry has essentially potion skills and flowery names on both sides of his family. On James' side, the Potter could be trace back to Linfred of Stinchcombe, "originator of a number of remedies that evolved into potions still used to this day, including Skele-Gro and Pepperup Potion" and Iolanthe Peverell, Iolanthe means violet flower. On Lily's side, Lily was gifted at potion making and her name Lily, which could be a flower, and a violet one too. It seems destiny for James and Lily to be together. Or who knows maybe they could even be distant related. While the direct line from Linfred to James is of pureblood, but as the Pottermore article said, there have been other in the family that had married muggle/muggleborns. James' distant cousins may have married into the Evans and and be Lily's ancestors. Lily is muggleborn but who knows maybe it's a very distant cousins of James from way back who may have married into the Evans family and that branch been marrying only muggles/muggleborns that by the time the line reach Lily, it may only seems Lily is muggleborn because she's like 1/1,080 magic.Seasrmar (talk) 09:20, December 26, 2015 (UTC) I think that JKR said in an interview (possibly in relation to Hermione, but it would also apply to what you just said) that many muggle-borns had squib ancestry. The three Peverell brothers did not have flowery names, but Iolanthe did - so it is more than likely that Iolanthe inherited her flowery name from either her mother's or her grandmother's family rather than her paternal line. I am not a James fan and wonder how much better things would have been if James was never born - though I do like his family history. James makes the lead character of the old Rocket Robin Hood cartoon look meek and humble by comparison. (Vaudree (talk) 16:15, December 26, 2015 (UTC)) Change of Blood status As I have a feeling that this is going to cause an edit war, I'm asking here. When did the family blood status change to "half-blood"? The moment James married Lily or the moment Harry was born? My belief is that it was when Harry was born as Lily marrying James did not affect the rest of the family. Yes, he married a muggleborn, but if they died without children then the rest of the family would still be pure; him marrying her does not affect the status of the family. Harry, however, does as he is not a pure-blood due to his mother's muggle ancestry. --HarryPotterRules1 (talk) 02:23, May 6, 2017 (UTC) : Yeah, this one is more tricky. I would suggest we leave this until we sort out what it means to be a pure-blood family as it has bearing on the timing of the status. Cheers --Ironyak1 (talk) 02:48, May 6, 2017 (UTC) :: Hi. I noticed the article has "Pre July 1980" next to pure-blood status but shouldn't it technically say "Pre October 1981" since James was still living, and was pure-blood up until then? Couldn't the family have more than one blood status at the same time? -- Kates39 (talk) 10:59, May 11, 2017 (UTC) ::: We have still been arguing out what it means to be a pure-blood family. My assertion is that the family stops being a pure-blood one when Lily marries in as JKR has said repeatedly that to be a pure-blood family one has to stop marrying Muggles and Muggle-borns, or remove them from the family tree (see Talk:Pure-blood#Pure-blood_-_what_does_it_mean.3F_Round_2. I would probably just put both pure-blood and half-blood as the statuses and we can argue about when and how it changed. :::I would also assert that outside of Iolanthe, James I, Harry and his kids, we don't know the blood-status for Hardwin, Henry, Fleamont, etc... As with the Malfoys, there can be many a half-blood in a pure-blood family tree. ::: PS something appears to have gone sideways in the Fleamont section as it has garbled text. I was going to fix but don't want to cause an edit conflict while you're working through such massive text. Keep calm and edit on ;) --Ironyak1 (talk) 11:16, May 11, 2017 (UTC) :::: I agree. I think what we need to decide is whether the marriage itself changes the blood status for the entire family, or just when the couple have children. Technically, the parent who married into the family isn't related to them by blood up until they have a child. It is only then that parent's blood status changes someone else's. :::: Lily being muggle-born never changed James' personal blood status, but it did change Harry's. Had Lily divorced James before they had children, would the Potter family stay half-blood just because Lily would still be on their family tree? You could also argue that the family is also muggle-born by marriage when you go through the route that marriage changes things. :::: So does part of the family remain pure-blood up until James' death, or does it officially change to half-blood upon Harry's birth? Or does Lily marrying into the family change everything aleady? :::: Thanks! I fixed the section about Fleamont but I will have to continue working on Harry's extensive section later. -- Kates39 (talk) 11:52, May 11, 2017 (UTC) ::::: Looking at the Black family tree from JKR the reasons given for being blasted off it include marrying a muggle or muggle-born. It appears that for the family to remain "Always pure" it cannot have muggles or muggle-borns married in regardless of any children being born. Pure-blood is not strictly about biology, it's a statement against marrying muggles or muggle-borns (or generally being pro-muggle given some of the other reasons given for banishment from the family tree). ::::: The whole Potter family blood-status is never stated anywhere, but inferred from the line they weren't included on the Sacred Twenty-eight because of suspected muggle origins due to their name, and inferred from James Potter I being a pure-blood. But just becuase one member is a pure-blood does not make the entire family so. ::::: I don't think divorce exists in the HP universe so we're deep into theoretical territory there ;) The only related example involving blood-status I can think of is the splitting of the Umbridge family with mom and the squib son leaving to live as muggles. If the Blacks can blast muggle-lovers and squibs off their tree and remain pure, would a divorce or permanent separation work as well to remain as a pure-blood family? --Ironyak1 (talk) 12:35, May 11, 2017 (UTC) :::::: Personally, I would say blood status only changes when a child is born to the name. I don't think think the marriage changes the status on it's own. Couldn't the Potter family be both pure-blood and muggle-born by the definition marriage alone changes things, and then half-blood when Harry was born? :::::: The Black family go to the extreme when it pertains to blood status. I don't think it was the idea that it would change their own blood status from pure-blood, but more the association with someone who even has pro-muggle leanings. They also get rid of people who disappoint them - Sirius and his uncle, for example. :::::: I agree the whole Potter family do not have to be pure-blood for James to be, but I think since Harry is the first known half-blood member, "pure blood (1960-1981)" and "half-blood (1980-)" might cover both interpretations better? I don't think we should outrule a family can have more than one status at the same time.-- Kates39 (talk) 16:38, May 11, 2017 (UTC) ::::::: I don't think there is any precedent for a family having multiple statuses (as a family, though individuals within the family may vary). From the Sacred Twenty-Eight directory, there is one blood-status given for the entire family at that given time. ::::::: I don't want to repeat the whole argument done over at Talk:Pure-blood (see all the JKR references there), but the defining feature of a pure-blood family is not marrying Muggles and Muggle-borns. Being a pure-blood family is a political statement against wizard/Muggle marriage so having a Muggle or Muggle-born marriage into your family would prevent you from embodying these ideals (hence the need to blast them off or disown them, regardless of children). The Malfoy defines this minimum requirement to be a pure-blood family by not marrying Muggles or Muggle-borns since the passage of the Statue of Secrecy, but still marrying half-bloods. ::::::: However, as we don't really know the triggering event, I would suggest we simply put "Pure-blood (formerly)" and "half-blood" with refs to how the Potters were likely pure-blood based on the language used on PM about the Pure-blood directory and James Potter I's confirmed pure-blood status, and how they are not now based on Lily's marriage and Harry's half-blood status confirmed by JKR. That work? Cheers --Ironyak1 (talk) 17:04, May 11, 2017 (UTC) :::::::: Yes, that sounds fine. I have hoped for a long time that Rowling would write something up that clarifies the ins and outs of how blood status works, but we're still waiting! I agree Rowling intends the marriage to have some weight on the wizarding societies perception of a family, but in hindsight, perhaps we should defer from putting a date on when and therefore how that changed for certain for the time being. -- Kates39 (talk) 17:47, May 11, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::: Yeah - it'll be interesting if we get any more clues in FB - Leta is a Lestrange after all, or perhaps we'll the witness impact of the Pure-blood directory as the movies will take place in part during the 1930s, or meet some of the Potters or Malfoys of the day. Overall, I think that a lot of speculation has grown up around this topic that is not supported by the several statements JKR has given us which contributes to the confusion. It wasn't until I went back and re-read all the related materials and references in the books at the same time that her system became more clear to me. FWIW it was not I that added the dates, but it did prompt the discussion so it all works out. Keep on keeping up the good fight :) --Ironyak1 (talk) 18:05, May 11, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::: I have made the changes and added the references as discussed but feel free to make some adjustments as you see fit! :::::::::: Upon re-reading , I am now in complete agreement with the idea that the Potter family were no longer considered truly pure-blood when James married Lily, so I thought I would leave the quote that backs that up here for future reference on the talk page, as it overrules some of what I said! - "To call oneself a pure-blood was more accurately a declaration of political or social intent ('I will not marry a Muggle and I consider Muggle/wizard marriage reprehensible') than a statement of biological fact." -- Kates39 (talk) 19:39, May 11, 2017 (UTC) Biography I thought the page was meant to give people an overview of the history of the Potter family, but it goes into great detail about James in particular as though it is a biography about him. Do we need lengthy paragraphs about the ins and outs of the Marauders and what they got up to, and how they called Snape "snivellus" etc on a page that is about the family in general? Surely people can follow the links to read up in more detail about James on his actual page. -- Kates39 (talk) 17:40, May 10, 2017 (UTC) :Agreed - article should be an overview of the entire family. Members should have a summary paragraph and link to the relevant main article. There is no reason to repeat everything here especially for members with lots of details like James I and Harry. --Ironyak1 (talk) 18:11, May 10, 2017 (UTC) :: I will start cleaning up the page. I have invited User:Tvurta, who added the information to the page, to have a say but the page will need to be edited to reflect what is needed instead. -- Kates39 (talk) 20:01, May 10, 2017 (UTC) "Moved through the forest of dean" "Hardwin Potter (Linfred's eldest son) moved the family through the Forest of Dean to the village of Godric’s Hollow, where he married a beautiful young witch by the name of Iolanthe Peverell." The forest of dean is never mentioned in the linked citation. All it says is "Linfred’s eldest son, Hardwin, married a beautiful young witch by the name of Iolanthe Peverell, who came from the village of Godric’s Hollow." In fact, googling "hardwin potter" "forest of dean" "godric's hollow" brings up no results unrelated to this wiki. The edit that introduced this information: https://harrypotter.wikia.com/index.php?title=Potter_family&diff=1061993&oldid=1061984 The user, according to their talk page, apparently has a history of adding fanon and committing vandalism to pages, and has been both warned and blocked in the past. Seems to have been permanently blocked. I believe this information regarding the Forest of Dean needs to be removed, as there is no evidence of this being accurate, and no indication of where it came from. BrentNewland (talk) 23:05, September 16, 2018 (UTC) :Very well spotted; I removed it from the article. Good work! -- [[User:Seth Cooper| Seth Cooper ]][[User talk:Seth Cooper| owl post!]] 00:51, September 17, 2018 (UTC) Family tree Currently, I think the family tree has way too many unnecessary members. For example, do we really need to list all the Sayre and Gaunt family members on a page about the Potter family just because both are related to the Peverell family? I don't think so. In fact, I think all of Cadmus Peverell's descendants and people who are only connected to the Potters through them (as well as Bellatrix Lestrange, who is also connected through Dorea Black and the only Black family member besides Dorea to be listed just because she had a child with Voldemort who is a descendant of the Peverells who are also ancestors of the Potters) should be removed from the page because they aren't members of the Potter family and those families already have their own pages. PetStarPlanet (talk) 23:38, September 13, 2019 (UTC)